The Public Opinion Soapbox

AnonyMouse · Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 527

I'll kick this one off.

You simply cannot completely control immigration in this country if you want to have the kind of America we have now, which is to say, an America which is not a police state. That doesn't mean you shouldn't have an immigration policy. You should. But with borders as big as ours, a population as diverse as ours, and civil liberties as robust as ours, it's just not possible to put an end to illegal immigration.
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Now, go spread some peace, love and understanding. Use force if necessary.

A Talking Horse · Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 143 Location: Cove Gap

The whole "border control" argument is a total kenard and short sighted.

Unless you control the Americans who are hiring illegals first - the border crossings will continue.

You know who has a fence on their border...? CHINA! - yeah, lets be more like them!

Dave · Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 162

The fence idea is not the answer. Like they say, build a 15 foot fence and Walmart will be selling 16 foot ladders.

TH is right when we need to enforce laws against businesses hiring illegals. If we take away the main reason to come here, they won't come or at least not so many.

Take away from some of the government services. Crack down on companies that offer them services - like credit cards that don't require a SS number.

They don't work for less - that is a myth. If they work for $5, they live cheap & send $2.50 home. That $2.50 buys quite a bit of stuff in mexico.

We need the current administraion to stop taking dying people to court over medical marijuana and either enforce the law or allow local police forces to do it.

lwstepler · Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 15

Is the wall in China there to keep people in or keep people out? Also, eliminating the market for illegal aliens is much like eliminating the market for illegal drugs. Do we then stop prosecuting the drug lords because the "real" solution is to eliminate the drug market? Question

me · Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 119

Our founding fathers intention was for our country to be one of certain freedoms, based on common law.

The key word there is LAW. They never could have forseen the illegal immigration problem this nation is faced with today, if they had been able to, they surely would have placed laws or Consitutional provisions in place to protect agains it.

Our country is facing, no is in the midst of a dire delima and that is the flood of illegal immigration and what it will cost this nation and the legal citizens of this nation. Illegals are destroying this country and the beliefs it was founded on!!!

So, what do we do??????? Address illegal immigration and illegals now or pay the price down the road and who knows what that will be!!!!! And the cost will be much, much more than just dollars !!!!!????!!!!!!

Illegals are destroying this country and the beliefs it was founded on!!!

walrus1 · Joined: 23 Oct 2007 Posts: 63

The illegal immigration problem, to a large extent, could be managable with minimal effort. Remove the jobs and any resources and not only would most of them not come here but those here would return home.

The status quo continues to provide cheap labor to businesses. By keeping the workers illegal it forces them into the shadows of society and allows businesses to take advantage of them. The current system hurts the middle class and abuses the immigrants. It provides cheap labor to businesses and some companies don't pay workmen's comp, benefits, taxes or any of the other normal costs with hiring American workers. In some areas jobs that were once worked by Americans and supported families are now taken almost exclusively by illegals making less then half with no benefits or costs. As this continues it will only hurt american workers more by lowering salaries. All the while we have no idea of who is coming and going and putting americans at risk and draining tax money and social systems. If Canada can have a working guest worker program why can't we.... if we only allow people to work through the guest worker program and hold companies responsible it will illiminate most illegal immigration.

Dave · Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 162

Unfortunately, the current administration wants cheap labor and thereby does nothing including blocking state & local enforcement.

Unbelievable · Joined: 23 Oct 2007 Posts: 19 Location: New Franklin

If INS were as hard on the illegals as they are on the legit immigrants the issue would not be this far along.
My sister in law is from overseas. She is a college educated, legal, green-card carrying resident, married to an American. After a recent trip to her native home to visit aging family, my brother had to fly to meet his family and escort them back into the United States because she is hassled EVERY time she goes through Detroit or Chicago airports. Its a crime. She isn't taking any Americans job (she runs an on-line business selling items to people in her homeland), she is raising my nephew in the heart of the U.S. and has lived there for a number of years, but gets nothing but problems from INS, customs and everyone else. It's an embarassment.
My brother lived in her country for several years and was considered a citizen because he held employment and contributed to society. He never had any trouble.
Go figure.
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It's not what you do once in a while, its what you do day in and day out that makes a difference!

BadKarma42 · Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:31 pm Post subject:

I've worked with ICE on raids here. The local department of ICE wants to do more to clean things up. But, they have redtape to go through and can't do what they want to do (grab all of the illegals) unless they clear it through offices higher than them.

For example, El Dorado Stone was visited. You should have seen all the nervous people at lunch time/break time. El Dorado management was not cooperative.

The easy thing would have been to check all the employees. However, all ICE could do was notify the business investigation division.

More people need to speak out to keep us from becoming more of a sanctuary city than we already are.

pathfinder_17233 · Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 3:45 pm Post subject:

illegal means illegal no matter who it is or where they come from. so what is the problem?

Dave · Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 162

Just once, I would like to hear a politian explain why we can't send all the illegals back.

If we run short of labor, we can always let in more LEGAL immigrants.

We also need to change the law to read only babies born of LEGAL U.S. parents are citizens.

The Republicans really screwed up on Immigration. They sat back and allowed Bush to block meaningful reform. Now it is in the hands of Democrats. And yet those Republicans still love their man Bush. Can't figure it.

pathfinder_17233 · Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 4:55 pm Post subject:

As a Repubican who voted for Mr Bush twice, i have lost faith in Mr Bush
and the Republican Party. it scares me to see where i think he is taking us as a nation. The Democrats scare me even more, maybe i listen too much of what Glenn Beck is saying! Are we beinging betrayed by our own goverment?

walrus1 · Joined: 23 Oct 2007 Posts: 63

why yes, yes we are...

both major parties represent special interests and lobbies, they no longer represent or even try to represent the voters. The Republicans lie to their traditional base and then laugh about their religeous beliefs or ignore their wishes and then do whatever is in the best interest to the businesses they represent.

The Democrats lie to their base... what have they done for union workers, Catholics, minorities or their tradtional base in the last thirty years. They pay off the Union leaders and minority leaders to deliver the vote and then either ignore them, or worse, pass laws in direct contridiction to the people who voted them into office.

When Hillary was first running for the Senate and her husband was still in office, a small community in New York were able to get pardons for two of their people in exchange for delivering the district to her. Why can a few hundred people who stick together get action when millions of voters can't? Because they didn't give away their vote! When you and the group you fit into only vote for one party no matter what they do because the other party is less appealing, you will never be represented because they have no need to earn your vote. Don't think they will represent you because they have similar beliefs and morals because none of them do, they only wish to get elected.

anonymous_coward · Joined: 24 Oct 2007 Posts: 564

I hope you realize that the "natives" that were here when your ancestors immigrated hated and discriminated against your kin. And if you use the "well it wasn't illegal then" argument, just be glad they didn't make it so. they would have enforced it vigilante style and you would still be in ireland, italy, germany, or wherever.

but why do we learn history anyway, it's not like it repeats itself

Mixolydian · Joined: 13 Oct 2007 Posts: 32 Location: Chambersburg

I know this fellow who has a t-shirt that shows a group of 19th Century Native Americans in full war regalia, below the words: "Homeland Security, fighting terrorism since 1514"